Just to give you some data to your theory about the vulnerability of pets and narcissistic supply, the narcissist I dated withheld sex and used the silent treatment for quite a long time when I decided to foster a dying cat. She was 11 and had a feeding tube and UTI and he would frame her throwing up or peeing on objects as a personal threat to him and our connection because it took away my energy and love. If she even wanted to cuddle, it was an issue. Fascinating.
Thank you Richard for validating and clarifying my experiences with one of these characters. The new learning for me from this video, is on the aspect of their shame and how it becomes self-loathing but only because they’re failing to convince others of their greatness not because they think they behaved badly. Very interesting – thanks 🙏
Instead of overt/covert, couldn't you just say successful/failed narcissist? Some get away with it & are swimming in supply & others just can't set up enough supply & have to play poor me to trap people with weak boundaries & unhealthy compassion to get supply.
Yep, it would be great if "Bilbo Baggins" (Midwits) got off you tube and got a real job and stopped "helping"….. Sick of these self proclaimed experts screwing with people's lives time and trust Thanks Richard for the sense and sensibility…..
I just want to add as a mother, that there is always a competition between the narc and my children. Your envy question was so on point. And everytime i try to leave, the fragile child behavior thah in a weird way makes me feel like im discarding one of my own and not a stranger.
Yes!As a person who has been in a 23 year relationship with the devil, i agree its hust one disorder. When you, the supply, try to leave they become fragile, break down, apologize and become the child that needs protection, and then slowly turn it around on you. And then another layer of resistance is stripped from you meanwhile reinforcing the supply. They then go out with extra glow and attract outside supply. Its one devil
Richard my handsome boyfriend 😍👏❤️ Oki dokie 😂😂😂 I want to dance with you in the balcony ha ha 😂😂 💿 making some noise 💿 in Ibiza ohh my babyyy but clapping with shoes ha ha under beautiful Spanish sky with you 😂😂🎊
No I know, why it has been so quiet at my neighbours – his girlfriend is with somebody else in your hotel 😂🤣 I actually had the same reaction like you, when I first heard her, because I thought, somebody needed help 😅 And thanks again for sharing your knowledge so generously and with good humour. It helped me a lot along the way 🙏
So if a grandiose narcissus falls from grace and loses all their status such as Huw Edwards and Neil Gaiman – then they become vulnerable narcissists – showing my age now – but years ago there was a TV chat show host called Simon Dee who was incredibly successful and massively vain and arrogant – then someone came on his show drunk or drugged and was just awful and the show never recovered and was cancelled so Simon Dee became a real has been and his life went off the rails – years and years later he was given a second chance – some bright spark decided to see if they could resurrect his career – he only had one show – and it was very lacklustre because Dee was by then a broken man – he tried valiantly to recover his old sparkle but it was gone and he was just pathetic but in true narcissistic fashion he did not realise how past it he was. Then the show runners did something very cruel but funny. Over the closing credits they played an incredibly angry arrogant narcissistic tantrum answerphone message that Simon Dee had left on their phone – it was both pathetic and hilarious – he was especially furious that the doorman did not know who he was! He had not been on television for decades but still had that centre of the universe syndrome that narcissists never lose.
I think the Grandiose-Vulnerable spectrum is a mapping of how a person approaches the goals of narcissism based on the tools their personality gives them. With the Big 5, the most grandiose narcissist is low agreeableness, high extraversion, low neuroticism. The most fragile narcissist is the opposite of those three. Fragile narcissists need to avoid conflict while feeding, be careful with their supply because they have trouble replacing people, and feel more physical pain from their negative emotions. Richard, you know a lot more real world samples than I do. Does that pattern hold true for what you've seen?
On the other side of interactions, there are people who think the spectrum is Grandiose-Covert. And I think they don't like low agreeableness, high extraversion people. Then they have an easier time identifying narcissists that already fit in the group of people they don't like. When they become aware of a narcissist who doesn't fit in that box, they think they were fooled because the fragile narcissist was being sneaky.
I think all narcissists are the same. Their actions differe only based on their social hierarchy or power. If they have their own business they will react as malignant, the same one is going to be an overt if he/she is an employee.
Can you go from dependent personality to narcissist? Can one going from an adaptive response (co-dependent) to being perpetrator (narcissist) in the next relationship? Could a narcissist be a failed co-dependent?
Do you think NPD moves between toxic feminin and toxic masculin. Not moving forward but switching and staying stagnant. Causing an illusion of moving forward but actually just switching to look like there is some kind of progress going on. As Chris brown says ‘all you can do is watch me, look what I can do with my feet, feel the beat inside.’ That switch over, very intriguing, yet very desperate for investment. Hope I don’t sound nuts haha it’s just a thought I have. Somewhere I read that as they draw you into a toxic feminine or masculine that’s when the trauma bond occurs.
😂😂😂😂 laughing about the roggering😂😂😂😂 who ever said procrastinating 😂😂😂😂so funny, 😂😂 put a smile on my dial😂😂😂😂 yeah, careful, they might land on you!
OMG !!! Richard thankyou, you just revealed another tactic!!!! Just when I thought you had identified/exhausted all of them, you just revealed another! Cant say anything else, my keyboard is playing up again, such timing! 😂
A covert malignant narcissist who is highly pathological may exhibit extreme competitiveness in their level of dysfunction and manipulation. This type of narcissist may become so consumed by their need to be superior—even in their pathology—that they project their worst traits onto others, especially those who are not afflicted by similar psychological issues.
### How They Operate: 1. **Twisting Reality**: They have a remarkable ability to distort reality to suit their narrative. Their interactions are full of subtle manipulation, where they gaslight others, making them doubt their own perceptions and feelings. This is not just about casual lying or manipulation; the covert malignant narcissist genuinely sees themselves as the victim or hero, even while they inflict harm.
2. **Projection**: Projection is a key defense mechanism for them. Instead of facing their own deeply ingrained flaws, such as insecurity, deceit, or cruelty, they project those traits onto others. Someone who is kind and empathetic may be labeled as manipulative or selfish by the narcissist. In doing so, they alleviate any sense of guilt or self-awareness about their own behavior.
3. **Competitive Pathology**: The covert malignant narcissist thrives on being seen as unique, even in their level of dysfunction. They may view their own pathological tendencies as a mark of distinction, competing to be "higher rung of dysfunction" than others. In their twisted mindset, they may even seek validation by being the most victimized or misunderstood person in any group, while systematically tearing down those who aren't afflicted by the same mental turmoil.
4. **Targeting the Healthy**: They often project their dark traits onto individuals who are healthy or balanced in their emotional lives. By doing this, they can manipulate situations to make others appear as though they are the ones who are narcissistic or manipulative, all while the covert narcissist continues to operate under the radar. These false accusations serve as a way to transfer their internal chaos onto unsuspecting individuals, shifting blame and maintaining their sense of superiority.
In short, a covert malignant narcissist's pathology may lead them to compete in a perverse sense, not to be better or healthier, but to be more dysfunctional or damaged. Their projection of traits onto others serves to preserve their own fragile self-image, while distorting the truth and creating confusion in those around them.
Just want to say a Thank you, for me understanding about the Narcissist. I am 69yrs old, had shite childhood, shite marriage, have spent 30yrs on my own, no trust in anyone, cannot get close to anyone. But until I started watching you about 1-2yrs ago, didn't understand why. I am only just getting to know me, I have never known me. I have always been told who I am, depending on who it was, to fit with their life, their purpose for me. Always thought it was me doing the wrong thing. Am I fixed, No, but happier with knowing the why. I will always now be on my own, but again happier because it is what I choose, and understand why I choose this. Many thanks, keep up the good work. XXX
I’m having one of the worst times of my life right now. I am even afraid to talk about what’s going on right now in this comment section because I’m afraid of my family seeing.
He never says the words, “I’m sorry,” when he should take personal responsibility. I have only heard him say, “I’m sorry” your friend died, your Mother’s ill etc.. He has never cried in front of me. His Mother died a horrible death, alone, in her home, and was not found for two months. I kid you not, she was partially eaten by the several cats she owned bc they were stuck in her home. Je was called my the coroner to give a DNA sample. He never went to her home to see the damage. Her landlord tried to sue him for her back rent, bills etc. He then hired a lawyer to handle it. He won. He walked away with such detachment, he said to me, “Yeah, I miss her, but it’s over now.” The end. Insane. I thought, he’s a monster. Yet, I stayed, partially. This is just one example. There’s an entire “ick list.” Wtf!
Truth is….. The covert narcissist has often times been cultivated and developed via trauma and abuse in a chaotic and unhealthy childhood environment….. They typically are desperately attempting to flee from the reality of their lives by embracing self induced fantasy and delusion.
Watching late- I’ve been with a covert and let me tell you. I thought I met the devil 👿 it’s like dealing with a poisonous snake 🐍 in the grass. The sad part is that once you are out of it for good, the healing process is painful and lonely 😞 No one can truly understand this unless you have been through a sick twisted relationship. Just run 🏃♀️ don’t want, Runnnnn. They will beg and fake cry saying they have changed. He admitted that he was trying to make me crazy, so yes they are fully aware.
🎯 Nailed it, RG! In hindsight, I can see clearly now how one ex of mine behaved as a vulnerable (I agree with you that a narcissist/ someone with high trait narcisism is a narcissist is a narcissist. It just depends on whether they have a good source of supply & they're elated or the supply dries up & they're in withdrawal/ depleted) narcissist. He variously at times thru our 5 yr relationship apologised, brought me flowers, even conjured up some crocodile tears to hook/hoover me back in after we broke up or I called him out on some of his shit behaviour. At times when that didn't work on me, he 'became' physically ill. He genuinely did have kidney stones & got treatment for them etc but there were so many times he was in 'agony' from unspecific pain needing me to drive him to ER & wait in hospital waiting rooms with him for hours until he could be seen by a dr etc. Ie: I had to be his nurse/mother. In the end, I'd just call a dr for a home visit or a bloody ambulance! 😂 But then he changed tactics to the wonderful (for him) promotion & high paying job opportunity with the 'promise' of a future life filled with tropical beaches, travelling on our boat, happily ever after blah blah and I bought into that fantasy lock stock & barrel. In less than 8 months after our move , I was discarded/dumped & left mentally, emotionally, physically & financially wrecked 😢 Indeed, the vulnerable narcissist is so very hard to spot & 'leave' when the original abusive, neglectful narcissist in my life was my mother.
Faukse delusional self I get this needed praise avlot sulked when I didn't show aorecuationbto all he did ect example recent birthday posted thank u all for my. Birthday wishes especially like to thank. My beautiful wife she makes everyday special people asumed hecwas with me my phonevrang family was freaked put delusional ways no is mo no one has right over free will
Wow now I understand why a lot of drama took place in queues 🫣 He was expecting the red carpet rolled out 😜 I can laugh about it now but I remember shaking all over and froze when he threw his tantrum They are shameful to be around
Ok example asked to reconcile from message ov his solicitor my solicitor advised to contact law and stay in no contact hes trying to plead not guilty of harrasment ect categorise npd dependent covert co dependent people pleaser arrogant insecurity yes how it affects us manipulated ok his double lufe over 12 yrs poor to 2017 then harrased again less then lots more when something wrong and suss y we alowed it it's scarsbof structure of the scars it's affects to unlock the symptoms of its affects vary to us all ect domestic abuse he almost. Has breakdown meltdiwnbwhen things don't go his way child like imagination child that wants vunerbikty when pity to get it ect these videos reeducation fuels kniwldgevof who what I've been dealing with ect
I prefer “covert” over “fragile/vulnerable” because, as an empath, it helps signal me not feel sorry for them. But I love looking at ALL narcissists in terms of where they are in their elation/depletion cycles…and how the coverts have to live life with longer stretches of depletion.
Just to give you some data to your theory about the vulnerability of pets and narcissistic supply, the narcissist I dated withheld sex and used the silent treatment for quite a long time when I decided to foster a dying cat. She was 11 and had a feeding tube and UTI and he would frame her throwing up or peeing on objects as a personal threat to him and our connection because it took away my energy and love. If she even wanted to cuddle, it was an issue. Fascinating.
Your King is a narcissist.
Thank you Richard for validating and clarifying my experiences with one of these characters.
The new learning for me from this video, is on the aspect of their shame and how it becomes self-loathing but only because they’re failing to convince others of their greatness not because they think they behaved badly. Very interesting – thanks 🙏
Richard, I love what you have to say but PLEASE INVEST IN SOME DESCENT RECORDING GEAR!
Instead of overt/covert, couldn't you just say successful/failed narcissist? Some get away with it & are swimming in supply & others just can't set up enough supply & have to play poor me to trap people with weak boundaries & unhealthy compassion to get supply.
Yep, it would be great if "Bilbo Baggins" (Midwits) got off you tube and got a real job and stopped "helping"…..
Sick of these self proclaimed experts screwing with people's lives time and trust
Thanks Richard for the sense and sensibility…..
Great piece. Thanks. And maybe employ those 2 for background giggles to lighten the subject😂
I just want to add as a mother, that there is always a competition between the narc and my children. Your envy question was so on point. And everytime i try to leave, the fragile child behavior thah in a weird way makes me feel like im discarding one of my own and not a stranger.
Yes!As a person who has been in a 23 year relationship with the devil, i agree its hust one disorder. When you, the supply, try to leave they become fragile, break down, apologize and become the child that needs protection, and then slowly turn it around on you. And then another layer of resistance is stripped from you meanwhile reinforcing the supply. They then go out with extra glow and attract outside supply. Its one devil
Richard my handsome boyfriend 😍👏❤️ Oki dokie 😂😂😂 I want to dance with you in the balcony ha ha 😂😂 💿 making some noise 💿 in Ibiza ohh my babyyy but clapping with shoes ha ha under beautiful Spanish sky with you 😂😂🎊
No I know, why it has been so quiet at my neighbours – his girlfriend is with somebody else in your hotel 😂🤣 I actually had the same reaction like you, when I first heard her, because I thought, somebody needed help 😅 And thanks again for sharing your knowledge so generously and with good humour. It helped me a lot along the way 🙏
So if a grandiose narcissus falls from grace and loses all their status such as Huw Edwards and Neil Gaiman – then they become vulnerable narcissists – showing my age now – but years ago there was a TV chat show host called Simon Dee who was incredibly successful and massively vain and arrogant – then someone came on his show drunk or drugged and was just awful and the show never recovered and was cancelled so Simon Dee became a real has been and his life went off the rails – years and years later he was given a second chance – some bright spark decided to see if they could resurrect his career – he only had one show – and it was very lacklustre because Dee was by then a broken man – he tried valiantly to recover his old sparkle but it was gone and he was just pathetic but in true narcissistic fashion he did not realise how past it he was.
Then the show runners did something very cruel but funny.
Over the closing credits they played an incredibly angry arrogant narcissistic tantrum answerphone message that Simon Dee had left on their phone – it was both pathetic and hilarious – he was especially furious that the doorman did not know who he was! He had not been on television for decades but still had that centre of the universe syndrome that narcissists never lose.
Super helpful, thanks. I really need to hear that point about how narcissists do cry and apologize
I think the Grandiose-Vulnerable spectrum is a mapping of how a person approaches the goals of narcissism based on the tools their personality gives them. With the Big 5, the most grandiose narcissist is low agreeableness, high extraversion, low neuroticism. The most fragile narcissist is the opposite of those three. Fragile narcissists need to avoid conflict while feeding, be careful with their supply because they have trouble replacing people, and feel more physical pain from their negative emotions. Richard, you know a lot more real world samples than I do. Does that pattern hold true for what you've seen?
On the other side of interactions, there are people who think the spectrum is Grandiose-Covert. And I think they don't like low agreeableness, high extraversion people. Then they have an easier time identifying narcissists that already fit in the group of people they don't like. When they become aware of a narcissist who doesn't fit in that box, they think they were fooled because the fragile narcissist was being sneaky.
I think all narcissists are the same. Their actions differe only based on their social hierarchy or power. If they have their own business they will react as malignant, the same one is going to be an overt if he/she is an employee.
Can you go from dependent personality to narcissist? Can one going from an adaptive response (co-dependent) to being perpetrator (narcissist) in the next relationship? Could a narcissist be a failed co-dependent?
Do you think NPD moves between toxic feminin and toxic masculin. Not moving forward but switching and staying stagnant. Causing an illusion of moving forward but actually just switching to look like there is some kind of progress going on. As Chris brown says ‘all you can do is watch me, look what I can do with my feet, feel the beat inside.’
That switch over, very intriguing, yet very desperate for investment.
Hope I don’t sound nuts haha it’s just a thought I have.
Somewhere I read that as they draw you into a toxic feminine or masculine that’s when the trauma bond occurs.
Thank you for being transparent.
😂😂😂😂 laughing about the roggering😂😂😂😂 who ever said procrastinating 😂😂😂😂so funny, 😂😂 put a smile on my dial😂😂😂😂 yeah, careful, they might land on you!
OMG !!! Richard thankyou, you just revealed another tactic!!!! Just when I thought you had identified/exhausted all of them, you just revealed another! Cant say anything else, my keyboard is playing up again, such timing! 😂
ChatGPT
A covert malignant narcissist who is highly pathological may exhibit extreme competitiveness in their level of dysfunction and manipulation. This type of narcissist may become so consumed by their need to be superior—even in their pathology—that they project their worst traits onto others, especially those who are not afflicted by similar psychological issues.
### How They Operate:
1. **Twisting Reality**: They have a remarkable ability to distort reality to suit their narrative. Their interactions are full of subtle manipulation, where they gaslight others, making them doubt their own perceptions and feelings. This is not just about casual lying or manipulation; the covert malignant narcissist genuinely sees themselves as the victim or hero, even while they inflict harm.
2. **Projection**: Projection is a key defense mechanism for them. Instead of facing their own deeply ingrained flaws, such as insecurity, deceit, or cruelty, they project those traits onto others. Someone who is kind and empathetic may be labeled as manipulative or selfish by the narcissist. In doing so, they alleviate any sense of guilt or self-awareness about their own behavior.
3. **Competitive Pathology**: The covert malignant narcissist thrives on being seen as unique, even in their level of dysfunction. They may view their own pathological tendencies as a mark of distinction, competing to be "higher rung of dysfunction" than others. In their twisted mindset, they may even seek validation by being the most victimized or misunderstood person in any group, while systematically tearing down those who aren't afflicted by the same mental turmoil.
4. **Targeting the Healthy**: They often project their dark traits onto individuals who are healthy or balanced in their emotional lives. By doing this, they can manipulate situations to make others appear as though they are the ones who are narcissistic or manipulative, all while the covert narcissist continues to operate under the radar. These false accusations serve as a way to transfer their internal chaos onto unsuspecting individuals, shifting blame and maintaining their sense of superiority.
In short, a covert malignant narcissist's pathology may lead them to compete in a perverse sense, not to be better or healthier, but to be more dysfunctional or damaged. Their projection of traits onto others serves to preserve their own fragile self-image, while distorting the truth and creating confusion in those around them.
Hats off to Richard for staying so professional with all the "noise" coming from next door! Lol 👍
Just want to say a Thank you, for me understanding about the Narcissist. I am 69yrs old, had shite childhood, shite marriage, have spent 30yrs on my own, no trust in anyone, cannot get close to anyone. But until I started watching you about 1-2yrs ago, didn't understand why. I am only just getting to know me, I have never known me. I have always been told who I am, depending on who it was, to fit with their life, their purpose for me. Always thought it was me doing the wrong thing. Am I fixed, No, but happier with knowing the why. I will always now be on my own, but again happier because it is what I choose, and understand why I choose this. Many thanks, keep up the good work. XXX
I’m having one of the worst times of my life right now. I am even afraid to talk about what’s going on right now in this comment section because I’m afraid of my family seeing.
That’s mad shagging!!! Damn.😂
He never says the words, “I’m sorry,” when he should take personal responsibility. I have only heard him say, “I’m sorry” your friend died, your Mother’s ill etc.. He has never cried in front of me. His Mother died a horrible death, alone, in her home, and was not found for two months. I kid you not, she was partially eaten by the several cats she owned bc they were stuck in her home. Je was called my the coroner to give a DNA sample. He never went to her home to see the damage. Her landlord tried to sue him for her back rent, bills etc. He then hired a lawyer to handle it. He won. He walked away with such detachment, he said to me, “Yeah, I miss her, but it’s over now.” The end. Insane. I thought, he’s a monster. Yet, I stayed, partially. This is just one example. There’s an entire “ick list.” Wtf!
Truth is….. The covert narcissist has often times been cultivated and developed via trauma and abuse in a chaotic and unhealthy childhood environment….. They typically are desperately attempting to flee from the reality of their lives by embracing self induced fantasy and delusion.
Praying waiting hoping to get past this absolute worst thing I have ever been through in MY LIFE
19:37 Screen Freeze
Watching late- I’ve been with a covert and let me tell you. I thought I met the devil 👿 it’s like dealing with a poisonous snake 🐍 in the grass. The sad part is that once you are out of it for good, the healing process is painful and lonely 😞 No one can truly understand this unless you have been through a sick twisted relationship. Just run 🏃♀️ don’t want, Runnnnn. They will beg and fake cry saying they have changed. He admitted that he was trying to make me crazy, so yes they are fully aware.
🎯 Nailed it, RG! In hindsight, I can see clearly now how one ex of mine behaved as a vulnerable (I agree with you that a narcissist/ someone with high trait narcisism is a narcissist is a narcissist. It just depends on whether they have a good source of supply & they're elated or the supply dries up & they're in withdrawal/ depleted) narcissist. He variously at times thru our 5 yr relationship apologised, brought me flowers, even conjured up some crocodile tears to hook/hoover me back in after we broke up or I called him out on some of his shit behaviour. At times when that didn't work on me, he 'became' physically ill. He genuinely did have kidney stones & got treatment for them etc but there were so many times he was in 'agony' from unspecific pain needing me to drive him to ER & wait in hospital waiting rooms with him for hours until he could be seen by a dr etc. Ie: I had to be his nurse/mother. In the end, I'd just call a dr for a home visit or a bloody ambulance! 😂 But then he changed tactics to the wonderful (for him) promotion & high paying job opportunity with the 'promise' of a future life filled with tropical beaches, travelling on our boat, happily ever after blah blah and I bought into that fantasy lock stock & barrel. In less than 8 months after our move , I was discarded/dumped & left mentally, emotionally, physically & financially wrecked 😢
Indeed, the vulnerable narcissist is so very hard to spot & 'leave' when the original abusive, neglectful narcissist in my life was my mother.
…very true, thank you 👨⚕️🏏🤕
Absolutely loved it sorry I missed live version
Love your humour 😜
Richard Grannon thank you 👍👍❤👏👏👉🇦🇿
Are you referring to FB Coach R W? You sound so much like him Ns will never apologize 🫣
Faukse delusional self I get this needed praise avlot sulked when I didn't show aorecuationbto all he did ect example recent birthday posted thank u all for my. Birthday wishes especially like to thank. My beautiful wife she makes everyday special people asumed hecwas with me my phonevrang family was freaked put delusional ways no is mo no one has right over free will
Wow now I understand why a lot of drama took place in queues 🫣
He was expecting the red carpet rolled out 😜
I can laugh about it now but I remember shaking all over and froze when he threw his tantrum
They are shameful to be around
Ok example asked to reconcile from message ov his solicitor my solicitor advised to contact law and stay in no contact hes trying to plead not guilty of harrasment ect categorise npd dependent covert co dependent people pleaser arrogant insecurity yes how it affects us manipulated ok his double lufe over 12 yrs poor to 2017 then harrased again less then lots more when something wrong and suss y we alowed it it's scarsbof structure of the scars it's affects to unlock the symptoms of its affects vary to us all ect domestic abuse he almost. Has breakdown meltdiwnbwhen things don't go his way child like imagination child that wants vunerbikty when pity to get it ect these videos reeducation fuels kniwldgevof who what I've been dealing with ect
I prefer “covert” over “fragile/vulnerable” because, as an empath, it helps signal me not feel sorry for them. But I love looking at ALL narcissists in terms of where they are in their elation/depletion cycles…and how the coverts have to live life with longer stretches of depletion.